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Texas pastor: ‘God has given Trump authority to take out Kim Jong-Un’

President Trump, left, is greeted by Pastor Robert Jeffress of Dallas at the Celebrate Freedom Rally on July 1, 2017, in Washington, D.C. Photo by Yuri Gripas/Reuters

(RNS) — God has given President Trump the “authority to take out Kim Jong-Un,” according to the Rev. Robert Jeffress, one of the president’s key evangelical Christian advisers.

Jeffress’ statement on Tuesday (Aug. 8) followed the president’s warning earlier in the day that North Korea would “be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen” if its leader continues to threaten the United States.

The Texas preacher, who leads a congregation of more than 10,000 people at First Baptist Church in Dallas, has been an outspoken Trump supporter since early in the presidential campaign. He is one of dozens of conservative evangelical leaders who has enjoyed what one described as “unprecedented access” to this president who, they say, seeks their views on policy.

Jeffress released his statement early Tuesday evening as tensions between the two nuclear powers have escalated, and as Democrats and some Republicans criticized Trump’s remarks as reckless.

For the first time last month, North Korea successfully tested an intercontinental ballistic missile that could reach California, according to The New York Times. And The Washington Post reported this week that North Korea may have miniaturized a warhead that could fit inside such a missile.

In his statement, Jeffress said he believed the Bible makes clear that “God has endowed rulers full power to use whatever means necessary — including war — to stop evil.” The senior pastor praised Trump for not tolerating North Korea’s threats while panning previous administrations’ “sheepish stance toward dictators and oppressors.”

“When President Trump draws a red line, he will not erase it, move it, or back away from it,” he said. “Thank God for a President who is serious about protecting our country.”

In an interview with The Washington Post, Jeffress cited biblical verses from Romans 13, saying it “gives the government to the authority to do whatever, whether it’s assassination, capital punishment or evil punishment to quell the actions of evildoers like Kim Jong Un.”

Jeffress was a member of Trump’s evangelical advisory committee during the 2016 presidential election and since has attended several meetings of prominent evangelicals at the White House. That includes a dinner ahead of the National Day of Prayer, at which he assured, “Mr. President, we’re going to be your most loyal friends.”

Jeffress also recently hosted a Fourth of July concert at the Kennedy Center in Washington, D.C., where the president pledged his support to the military and to people of faith. First Baptist’s choir and orchestra premiered a musical arrangement of Trump’s campaign slogan, “Make America Great Again.”

Trump, who identifies as Presbyterian, has gone out of his way to embrace evangelical Christians. White evangelicals gave him 81 percent of their votes in November, a higher percentage than any other religious group.

About the author

Emily McFarlan Miller

Emily McFarlan Miller is a national reporter for RNS based in Chicago. She covers evangelical and mainline Protestant Christianity.

136 Comments

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  • Only an idiot would root for nuclear war using their bible. Christians will stop at nothing to start and apocalypse to prove their bible correct.

  • The god of love has given the Orange Buffoon authority to directly wipe out millions of people, and indirectly some hundreds of millions more, and as a consequence, a good portion of the rest of the planet.

    Yay, god! Let’s worship that god of love, because he so loved the world, he put an jackass and a demagogue in charge and thinks it’s just fine to cause billions of innocent people to suffer.

    Yay, evangelicalism! You’ve shown repeatedly that you have the morals and the brains of a congressman!

  • It is these types of ‘proclamations” that make christians look like buffoons.

    You can pray for our president, you can advise our president, but to say God has given authority to anyone, especially the president, is ridiculous.

    Here’s a little bit of advice, just because you say something does not make it true.

  • I’m afraid that Pastor Jeffress is misinterpreting Romans 13. Contrary to what Pastor Jeffress claims, there is a very strong strand of Gospel teaching which sees all secular government as the province of the sovereignty of Satan. This strand is completely consistent with Christ’s and the Apostle Paul and Peter’s unambiguous teaching not to repay evil for evil (Matthew 5:38-42; Romans 12:17; 1 Peter 3:9).

    Jesus stated expressly that: “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.” (John 18:36)

    Consider also the Apostle Paul’s clear teaching that “Satan is the god of this world” (2 Cor 4:4) and he is the “prince of the powers of the air” (Ephesians 2:2). The Apostle John concurs with this view and says that “the whole world lies under the power of the evil one.” (1 John 5:19ff, NASB)

    Consider also the teaching of the prophet Hosea who condemns Israel and affirms that there are powers not ordained by God. “They have set up kings, but not by Me: they have made princes, and I knew it not.” (Hosea 8:4)

    Compare Revelation 13 to Romans 13. Here we find a clear picture of a world government given “authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation”, while clearly not being God’s government. This government (whilst ultimately subject to the sovereignty of God) nevertheless arrogantly blasphemes against heaven and makes war on the saints and overcomes them. We find similar references to very corrupt and evil world governments in Daniel chapters 7 and 8.

    In his sovereignty God orders the powers that be (the government), but that does not mean that He necessarily morally approves of everything they do, any more than a librarian necessarily creates or approves of the contents of the book he or she shelves .

    Likewise God does not take the responsibility for the existence of the rebellious ‘powers that be’ nor for their shape or identity; they already are. Instead God, in His sovereign, permissive will, orders the powers, He brings them into line, that by His permissive government He lines them up to fulfil His purposes. This is true of all governments – whether they be the governments of dictators or tyrants or constitutional democracies, or even those of bandits or war lords, to the extent to which they exercise real sovereign control.

    The fact God orders and uses the ‘powers’ does not tell us how Christians should respond to government. It does not mean that God has mandated or saved or redeemed or made a particular government His chosen instrument. Instead, all governments are ‘lined up’ or ‘used’ by God in his sovereign ordering.

    This interpretation is further supported by Luke 4:5-8 where the devil shows Jesus all the kingdoms in the world and says all these kingdoms “have been handed over to me, and I give them to whomever I wish”. Jesus does not challenge the claim of Satan to be able to dispose of the rule of all nations.

    Pastor Jeffress should take care when he aligns himself so strongly with Trump or any secular government for that matter. As a Christian he should be instead aligning himself with Christ. Jesus said: “No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and the god of wealth”. (Matthew 6:24)

  • So god told Jeffress that King 45 ““gives the government to the authority to do whatever, whether it’s assassination, capital punishment or evil punishment to quell the actions of evildoers like Kim Jong Un.”” God is killing again…smh. SAD!

  • Trump should be slapped silly for uttering such a statement…these are not words that can be relegated to mindless chatter or locker-room talk…no doubt that we (Trump) is fully capable of such action but we (the world) must never allow such aberrant thinking to persist . Once again, Trump has shown that he is cut from the same pattern as the crazy korean fat dickless-tater baby boy.

  • Jeffress is an absolute maniac. I was regretfully part of his church when he did his “Make America’s Last days it’s best Days” series claiming that America was God’s new chosen country and that God had blessed it (I guess because he heard the phrase “God bless America”?). His pastoral care team also told me that although I was a Christian, God’s hand of blessing was removed from my life because I wouldn’t call sleeping in bed w/ my fiancee, now wife, a sin and I was not following their spiritual guidance. Donald Trump is dangerous, completely unfit for the job, and Jeffress is misleading his flock with this asinine American Exceptionalism-is-God’s-Will theology. If we go to war w/ NK, millions of lives will be lost.

  • :In a written statement released early Tuesday evening, Jeffress said he believed the Bible makes clear that “God has endowed rulers full power to use whatever means necessary — including war — to stop evil.”

    I just read Romans 13 (in the New Intnl. version of the Bible, c.1983) and it makes no mention of an earthly ruler “taking out” another ruler he thinks is doing evil. In fact, the only reference to weaponry in the chapter, states, “So let us put off the deeds of darkness and PUT ON THE ARMOR OF LIGHT.” That’s NOT the kind of weaponry that kills, but rather, the metaphor for God’s Love and Light that we are to put on!

    If the president were to authorize a strike “to take out Kim Jong Un,” such a strike would surely kill dozens of other North Koreans. Does this “use of whatever means necessary,” mean killing the innocent countrymen of said “leader” in the process?

    While studying for his light-weight Th.D., Jefferies should have dug into the New Testament more than the Hebrew Scriptures. (usually referred to as the Old Testament) In those prehistoric times, the Hebrew people’s crude concept of God included the use of violence and murder to survive. Although the N. Korean leader is coming very close to developing a delivery system strong enough to reach the US mainland, our survival is not yet at stake.

  • If there was ever a time for Pro-Life Christians to stand-up in defense of life, this is it.

    Jeffress is giving a church theological endorsement to Pres. Trump’s pretty clear threat of unleashing a pre-emptive nuclear holocaust on North Korea. This would kill into the millions of Korean people, including pregnant women and their unborn.

    If you believe human life is sacred, this is the time to stand-up.

  • Putting Jeffress aside for a moment, it’s not really possible for “all secular government” to be the “province of the sovereignty of Satan”, while at the same time being under the sovereignty of God.

    When you pray for our government leaders and “those in authority” in accordance with Romans 13, whose sovereignty are you acknowledging? Sure don’t look like Satan’s.

    In fact you ain’t giving Old Scratch credit for anything; you’re outright declaring that God is still in control, regardless of circumstances or situations. The sovereignty is His alone.

  • Another example of a Calvinist/Dominionist falsely claiming to be Christian.

    What this willfully ignorant fool does not realize we are now effectively if not actually at DEFCON 1. Go here for a good overview: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEFCON

    I’ve been at DEFCON 1 and its not fun & games.

  • What these ignorant Calvinists do not understand or realize is their placing the KJV above God & themselves as the sole interpreters is idolatry.

  • The Bible was written over 2,000 years ago by people who believed that the sun revolved around the earth. That some people today cite the Bible as a credible source for events happening in the 21st century is beyond my understanding.

  • Pretty much everyone in the world, except Trump has gotten the memo that North Korean grandstanding is really just a ploy to shake down neighbors for money. A major offensive strike by North Korea will lead to the end of the regime. They’ve known this for a while.

    The South Koreans can easily take out Kim and the North Korean regime on their own without us. They just don’t feel like turning economic powerhouse Seoul into a smoldering ruin or want the headache of trying to reintegrate the North into a modern society.

    Trump is proving himself to be dangerously incompetent here. There is no sane military solution here and he has no patience or ability with diplomacy.

  • Saner approach is to just leave divine authority of rulership out of the conversation altogether. It serves no purpose other than to indicate a given church is entangled with the state in an undue fashion.

  • And evangelical Christianity takes yet another giant step into oblivion. Those who care might want to speak up.

  • Looks like you win the R-&-S award yet again, Ben. I definitely can’t compete with you.

    Meanwhile, I’m noticing that most of us — with the exception of TheVine — are much quicker to jump on Jeffress than to wrestle with what he actually said.

    (Suppose Jeffress had said “Hitler” instead of “Kim Jong-Un.” Then what? Would you be so quick to complain?)

    We all finally realize that Obama’s diplomacy stuff didn’t work. Now North Korea can seriously burn one or two American cities, AND cripple much of our navy in Hawaii and Calif. And none of us have any solutions.
    So Jeffress dares to suggest that this is a just-war situation, and now we want to jump on him & Trump, just to relieve our own stress. Go figure.

  • On the contrary, we don’t need to be trying to censor God and Scripture out of the discussion of what Trump, Congress and America should do in a situation that is way past crisis-level already.

  • If Jeffress had lived several thousand years ago, and had made an equivalent proclamation, it probably would have been included in the Bible along with all the other ones grounded in ignorance/fantasy/delusion and/or fraud.

    Jeffress, of course, is only one of a large number of people still making nonsensical religion-based proclamations in the 21st Century. (Jim Bakker and Cindy Jacobs happen to be two of my favorites.) With so many documented proclamations available, I wonder why they have not been used as the basis for a vast expansion of the Bible. They would certainly fit right in.

  • Okay, let’s say that Trump is incompetent, as opposed to Obama and Hillary.

    We had 8 years of diplomacy under Obama and Hillary.
    Should have worked. Didn’t work.

    Now Kim Jong-Un has got himself some good ICBMs and good miniaturized warheads.

    Tell us your solution that will cause Kim to dismantle his nukes.

  • It certainly isn’t doing anything constructive here and undermines the president as the leader of the entire nation.

    The only reason we would be at crisis level here is because we have a president who has all the diplomatic skills of a rabid chipmunk. The world is more worried about his reaction than the absolute dictator deliberately trying to provoke him for giggles.

  • TrumXian National Anthem:

    Make America great again
    May she rule and dominate again.
    May her people be one color
    So they may love and trust each other.
    Make America great again.

    Make America grate again
    On the nerves of other nations
    May they cringe and cower in fear
    That Trump may cause world damnation
    Make America grate again.

  • I wouldn’t dismantle a thing, we all know that Trump is unwilling to tank his precious economy over North Korea.

    This is just Trump telling more lies.

  • I think it’s *very* constructive, because it helps all of us to start getting serious about the mess we’re in.

    Gotta stop pretending that either liberalism or conservatism, pacifism or militarism, diplomacy or warfare, Dems or GOPs, have any solutions to offer here. “Diplomacy” helped the NK, not the USA.

    As Ben Franklin and Abe Lincoln tried to warn us, this nation has forgotten God, and it’s been that way for quite a while. So now we all got big problems that we can’t solve, and time’s running out. Gotta go back.

  • I’m listening to the Almighty right now, and she’s telling me that Bobby is an idiot.

    I’m with her…

  • “Okay, let’s say that Trump is incompetent”

    He’s incompetent. Period.

    Obama had at least one diplomatic win which prevented longstanding bellicosity. The Iran deal defused what was a several year long bluff involving threats of military action by several countries.

    I didn’t see a whole lot of worry about war with North Korea during the last 20 years. A lot of sabre rattling and minor incidents. But in fact there was a boatload of cooperation from the North Korean’s allies and neighbors to keep things from getting hairy. Previous presidents from Nixon to Obama have seen the actions of North Korea for what they are, pure posturing and a grab for cash.

    As for diplomacy with North Korea, ANYONE but Trump would not have the leaders of South Korea and Japan (the countries most likely to suffer from an armed conflict here), scratching their heads thinking, “WTF is wrong with the American President?”, that they are doing now. They would also spend less time talking about fire and fury and more time on the phone with the president of China. The only country which really has any ability to apply hard pressure on the North Koreans.

    “Tell us your solution that will cause Kim to dismantle his nukes.”

    The same thing which worked for Iran, Momar Qaddafi and the South Africans, pay the guy and cart the stuff off. North Korea has uranium deposits but a piddling infrastructure for turning it into something useful.

    Add to that, diplomatic feelers to China. China depends more on trade with the US than it does for the raw materials and cheap labor it gets from North Korea. Also letting the South Koreans develop their own nukes. What will take North Korea at least a good number of years to do (thermonuclear weapons, nuclear missiles) South Korea can produce in a month if we let them.

    There is no military solution worth a damn here. We like Seoul and Western Japan the way they are.

    The real worry isn’t a North Korean missile strike, its a North Korean Chernobyl spewing radioactivity over the industrial heartland of Manchuria, South Korea and Western Japan.

  • This is a perversion beyond the pale. This Buffoon is a joke. His vile words should earn him a place right next to Jesus, who will punch his lights out.

  • How does Trump’s pussy grabbing and screwing underage girls sit with this Child Molester? Go back the airport bathroom and molest some more boys.

  • “Gotta stop pretending that either liberalism or conservatism, pacifism
    or militarism, diplomacy or warfare, Dems or GOPs, have any solutions to
    offer here. “Diplomacy” helped the NK, not the USA.”

    Far from it. It has kept the entire Korean Peninsula, Japan and China from being in a state of constant alert/war involving the US. Thanks to essentially keeping NK in check and isolating them from allies China and Russia, South Korea has emerged as a modern, democratic, economic powerhouse.

    Without the real existential threat to the nation, South Korea has flourished. It democratized without worry of looking weak to their belligerent neighbors. It developed its own industry and economy without having to divert the bulk of its resources towards defense. All done by isolating North Korea and containing their mayhem to token acting out.

  • Here’s my biblical solution. Let’s put Jeffers on a navy ship, throw him overboard in a big storm, watch a big fish swallow him, wait three days, start looking for puke on a beach, find Jeffers, have him preach diplomacy, watch him whine like a baby when folks aren’t utterly destroyed.
    Book of Jonah.
    Who says you can’t believe anything in the Bible?

  • “(Suppose Jeffress had said “Hitler” instead of “Kim Jong-Un.” Then what? Would you be so quick to complain?)”

    Back in the day preachers like Jeffress were generally America Firsters and Bund members.

    “We all finally realize that Obama’s diplomacy stuff didn’t work.”

    I don’t remember any tangible fears of sparking off a war which would leave South Korea and Western Japan as piles of rubble back then. Right now our allies in the region are more scared of what Trump will do than Kim Jong Un.

  • “(Suppose Jeffress had said “Hitler” instead of “Kim Jong-Un.” Then what? Would you be so quick to complain?)”

    You seem to be ducking it, so let’s look. “Jeffress cited biblical verses from Romans 13, saying it ‘gives the government to the authority to do whatever, whether it’s assassination, capital punishment or evil punishment to quell the actions of evildoers like Adolf Hitler.’”

    So, back in the day, would you have complained against any preacher who said that? Do you say that our government taking out Hitler & Co., was wrong?
    And by the way, did you protest Obama’s taking credit for Osama Bin Laden’s assassination? (Assuming, of course, that Obama didn’t steal the credit.)

    And if Obama’s 8-year diplomacy stuff DID work (as you are struggling to suggest), exactly how did North Korea get in ANY position to “leave South Korea and Western Japan (and San Diego, btw) as piles of rubble?”

  • Just the other day I was up on a mountain having an insightful conversation with a burning bush aka God and it told me Trump is an A$$.

  • Once again it is clear that stupidity is clearly in vogue. Stupid, so-called Christian, pastors abound. But my problem is this – he is not a maniac. That is saying he is insane and clearly he is not. I do not know if that makes him more or less dangerous. Jeffress’ approach is what makes present day so-called evangelicals so akin to the Russian Orthodox Church in Russia. They believe in Russian Exceptionalism – that indeed the new Jerusalem is Mother Russia – and Russian Orthodoxy Moscow style is the panacea. Jeffress is a sectarian. he does not acknowledge the universal church in all of its diversity. Therefore he is playing godfather over a congregation – and God help us – over a biblical illiterate president and they do not even realize they are being like lambs being led to the slaughter. This man has decried mainline churches as being idolatrous and organizations of the devil. And yet methinks this preacher doth protest too much and has become the very thing he decries.

  • The Pentagon identified North Korea as a threat with a likely capacity for ICBM missiles to reach the US way back under the Bush administration. The US has presumably had their eyes on what is going on there for a while. Why no action? Perhaps it was the lack of apparent success of their program. It is only since Trump took power that their program has publicly escalated (12 in the first 7 months of 2017 compared to 11 under Obama of which 2 were never independently verified and only 3 successful)y launched).

    Consider also how well more conventional warfare went for the US in Iraq/Iran and Afghanistan? Is that a factor? As well, NK is a potential threat to neighboring Asian countries as well. The US has participated regularly in supporting shows of military SK strength.

    A solution – Trump to exercise his authority under Executive Order 12333 to allow the CiA and DoF JFO to take targeted action against Kim Jong-Un if he doesn’t respond to the latest economic sanctions. Or allow China to take the lead in diplomatic efforts.

  • We didn’t “take out” H/tler, he killed himself, and it wasn’t in the face of the US, it was in the face of the Soviet troops invading Berlin. Of those high-ranking N@zis who we were able to capture, we put them on trial (except for those like Himmler who killed himself first like a c@ward). Of those, several received capital punishment (except for those like Goering who killed himself first like a c@ward). That is a far cry from suggesting that God is in favor of starting World War III to “take out” Kim.

  • My fear is that these kind of reckless statements will mean it’ll take longer for Jeffress’s type to step into oblivion than it will for the ROK, Japan or Los Angeles.

  • A strike to “take out” Kim would surely kill millions — not dozens — of Koreans, Japanese, and Americans. That’s because unless such a strike also negates the North’s nuclear capabilities, something most defense experts don’t think is guaranteeable or even feasibly possible, the strike would lead the North to respond with their Trump card (pun).

  • There is no solution, that’s the problem. There is no military solution, there is no diplomatic solution. In the words of WarGames, a 1983 movie that had a huge impact on me as a child of the Cold War, when it comes to the “game” of “global thermonuclear war,” “the only winning move is not to play.”

  • “So, back in the day, would you have complained against any preacher who
    said that? Do you say that our government taking out Hitler & Co.,
    was wrong?”

    Are we at war with North Korea? Is our existence as a nation at stake here? Bad analogies only get worse when one goes full Godwin.

    “And by the way, did you protest Obama’s taking credit for Osama Bin Laden’s assassination?”

    Nope. Didn’t care who took credit for that one. As long as he was dead and not from natural causes I was a happy camper. But that was personal for me. I lived through 9/11 close up in NYC and in ways I would rather not go into.

    “And if Obama’s 8-year diplomacy stuff DID work (as you are struggling to
    suggest), exactly how did North Korea get in ANY position to “leave
    South Korea and Western Japan (and San Diego, btw) as piles of rubble?””

    They have had that ability for a number of decades. Seoul has been under North Korean guns since 1953, Western Japan has been in the range of ballistic missiles since the early 1970’s. Diplomacy isn’t going to cause North Korea to completely disarm itself as a nation. Dictatorships like to hang on to their toys.

    You overestimate the threats here. The only thing from keeping South Korea and Japan from becoming nuclear powers of their own with ICBM capacity to reduce North Korea into a smoldering pile of rubble is their relationship with the US. South Korea and Japan are in the direct path of potential devastation here. A lot more at stake than the US. They aren’t asking for our assistance here as a military manner. They are trying to get us into the usual multiparty talks that keep NK isolated and mostly harmless. Trump is doing more harm than good.

    Interestingly enough, the purpose behind North Korea’s bellicosity, may be very much a diplomatic end.
    “What the North really wants is for formal diplomatic ties to be set up with the United States, and a [bilateral] dialogue. This has been its position all along,” he said.”
    http://www.rfa.org/english/news/china/northkorea-sanctions-08082017145335.html

  • Hmmm…Rev. Jeffress must be reading from the Donald Trump Version of the Bible. I use the NIV myself, and its version of Romans 13 doesn’t say a word about God giving the green light to government to use what Jeffress calls “assassination, capital punishment, or evil punishment” to get rid of bad guys. Rather, it does say that authority is ordained by God, and that Christians should obey it. Now, if you take this literally, as a fundamentalist would, you would have to draw the absurd conclusion that North Koreans would be wrong to rebel against Kim Jong-Un because all authority comes from God! However, Paul was writing for 1st century Christians who lived under the authority of the Roman Empire. In my opinion, he was urging them to “go along to get along”, don’t give the Romans an excuse to massacre them, and trust that God will deal with Rome in His own time and His own way.

  • It’s amazing that despite thousands of sects and denominations due to disagreement on basic doctrine and biblical interpretation, a minister claims to know the mind of god!

  • Hey, my sincere sympathies to you on 9/11, whatever took place. Many people still haven’t recovered really, even though the media has long moved on.

    I’m kewl with our government — Seals, Obama, Whomever — administering the death penalty on Osama. Romans 13-ish justice sort of thing, I suppose.

    But then it gets real difficult to jump on Rev. Jeffress for suggesting that a US President has a Romans 13-ish right to “quell the actions of evildoers such as Bin Laden Kim Jong-Un.” And in fact, it gets very difficult to jump on Trump for adopting an approach OTHER than Obama’s failed diplomatic stuff, which NK simply took advantage of until they were ready to up their game.

    Our naval forces at Pearl Harbor and San Diego, are now in range of NK nukes. But only to promote “formal diplomatic ties” and a “bilateral dialogue.” Yep.

  • None of us want a world war, period. We fear the possibility, and obviously with good reason. I don’t want any World War III, not at all.

    But my understanding is that the USA even turned back a boatload of fleeing Jews, we wouldn’t give them asylum nor let them set foot in our nation. We sent them back towards Nazi-controlled Cyprus or something.

    THAT, is how much we Americans feared the possibility of World War II. We’ll appease and cooperate with raw murderous evil, rather than risk entering into a large-scale war against such evil.

  • Kim Jong-Un is tickling the bear. So far his evil has been confined mostly to the ruling class of his own country, the standard oppression of his people and making Trump plotz himself.

    He knows an outright military provocation will end him and his country. There is nothing in it for him except as a way to extort cash from neighbors, including their allies China and Russia. The threat of something stupid being more useful than actually doing something stupid. Pretty much everyone but Trump realizes this. Which is why South Korea and Japan are shaking their head with this nonsense wondering what the hell Trump is doing.

    For example in Trump’s first meeting with Shinzo Abe, North Korea fired a missile test over Japanese airspace. Trump went into an inarticulate panic, Abe addressed the Japanese people in a calm manner. Treating it like a neighbor whose dog has crapped on their lawn.

    There is nothing to be gained in taking out Kim if we leave our allies in a complete mess in the process. Sane people who aren’t incompetent impatient miscreants have already taken military options off the table. Containment being the saner strategy.

    And lets make it more personal here. I would rather not have our hothead, ignorant incompetent president, who is absolutely terrible in all things related to foreign policy, and considered a menace by our own allies not do something stupid which turns my in-laws living in the suburbs of Osaka into piles of radioactive dust.

  • “We’ll appease and cooperate with raw murderous evil, rather than risk entering into a large-scale war against said evil.”

    Why do you want to turn Seoul into a pile of rubble?

  • The only way this is ending in a sane way is offering a boatload of cash to get North Korea to dismantle its sole nuclear power plant.

  • “Containment”? What containment?
    How do you “contain” ANY country that possesses ICBMs and nukes?

  • Well, we could always just repudiate our alliance with Seoul, just tell them to surrender themselves and all their freedoms — and their lives — to Kim’s merciful little hands. That would surely cancel out any threat of war.

    And then we can tell Japan and Guam and Phillipines the same thing.

    “Peace In Our Time,” some British diplomat guy once said.

  • The South Korean military can take out North Korea with or without our assistance. They are a modern force with people who have contemporary combat experience. They have the technology and infrastructure to go full nuclear with ICBMs within a month. They simply don’t want the headache. Japan can do the same.

    But it all comes down to “why bother?” The rewards are not great enough, the damage to themselves is too undesirable.

    North Korea is not a credible threat of anything existential to its neighbors. It is a threat of an act of mayhem. But that will cause a retaliation which will destroy themselves. Actual war is not their goal, nor are full fledged attacks on neighbors. The goal is to extort cash.

    This is a minor protection racket not a prelude to conquest.

  • how many innocents will God allow us to kill this time , We killed about 150,000 in IRAQ mostly women and children , some pregnant women ,When does this insanity and blaming God stop ??
    I have had my differences with David Wilkerson, But he was Right on the money with his book Last Days Deception in the Church

  • you can pray for this POS president all you want , You can believe every lie he tells you, But don’t be dragging GOD’s name into this ,

  • hit the button trump ….. lets give the evangelicals the armageddon they were promised , Russia ,Iran and China are just going to sit back and watch us destroy millions of lives near their shore and do nothing

  • Almost 75% of Americans say they can’t trust most or all of what they hear from the White House,

  • Okay. If he doesnt have “authority” hes certainly got the “firepower”. Just sayin.

  • That’s just how he frames it for public consumption. His type of Christian thinks they are god.

  • They are not Christians and they are not fetuses, so whatever you expect to hear from evangelicals, jefrress said it,

  • I can never understand the idiocy of right wing thinking.

    You say there was eight years of OBama that didn’t work? Was anyone threatening to go to war? What about nuclear annihilation?

    Nope?

  • Maybe…maybe not! Trump claims he has strengthened US nuclear capability that turns out to be yet another lie. The beginnings of a “review” doesn’t quite measure up to that claim.

  • This from an organization that calls itself “prolife”. Let’s just kill everyone!

  • Can you pass on this yellow sticky note for me, please, Emily McFarlan Miller?

    Speaking of “red line”, brother Robert Jeffress, beware, you’ve got one drawn for yourself, too. For if, like you said, “When (American) President Trump draws a red line” for “North Korean leader Kim Jong Un” – “he will not erase it, move it, or back away from it”, well, guess what, about yourself, whose supposedly born-again Christian mouth of God is filled up to the Rim of Gehenna with Cain-like (and I don’t mean John McCain either) murderously hateful talks?

    “When (Millennial Kingdom) President (Christ Jesus) draws a red line (for ‘Southern Baptist pastor Robert Jeffress’), he will not erase it, move it, or back away from it. Thank God for a President who is serious about protecting (not America or North Korea, but) our country (The Kingdom of God whose capital city is The New Jerusalem – from epidemically contagious backsliders and apostates).”

    Stop, full stop.

    Postscript: Trump’s no Hitler but this brother of mine, Robert Jeffress, sure is becoming like Hitler’s Protestant clerical whores who poured God’s blessings on that monster. How far Bible Christians and Bible Churches have fallen from God’s grace, it’s scary! Wanna become atheist myself because of them – were it not for the ransoming Fatherly love of God for me through the crucifixion, burial and resurrection of His own beloved Son, Christ Jesus. They lost each other for 3 days, Father killing His own Son. The Son reassuring Father, It’s OK, dad, You’ll wake Me up on the 3rd day, right? Promise? Cause gotta save this HpO character, knowwhatimean? Don’t know about that Jeffress guy, though? Whatdya think?

  • i, do not believe you are aware of just how precise physical control ELOHEEM has over this finite 7-day physical ReAccounting again.

    and it is even useless, to have all the power to even destroy this whole world. should ELOHEEM, never command for you to use it. for this whole world cannot be destroyed, prior to the end of the Seventh Day.

    even if you, have the power to assassinate any national leader. you still, need ELOHEEM to command this to physically happen.

    and i would prefer, ELOHEEM command the assassination of the boasting blowhard kim junk. involving less hell and death, to north koreans. even if it takes two asses, to have an ass-ass-ination. no alleged murderer boasting about, who they want to murder is productive to this world.

    but we are all stuck here in This Seven Day Story until physical death or the end of the seventh day – whichever comes first again. and failure to cooperate with ELOHEEM Now or HaMosheeach for The Seventh Day, is a most deadly and tragic affair. nor do i expect any different physical ending than before, the exact same way again this world is now.

  • Not quite sure what your point is but obvious that nothing good can come from Trump if any “review” should be subjected to your brand of analyses even if Trump worked ultimately to your own good or advantage. Heads of stone and hearts of putty.

  • See RJ Rushdoony, Dominion Theology, and Christian Reconstructionism. Their influence far exceeds their numbers.

  • Bill Clinton made a similar threat toward NK back in the day – prog libs didn’t get their red diapers in a bunch then.

  • President Obama, as Commander in Chief, gave the order to the Special Forces to go to India to kill Osama. Sorry, try as you might to change change history and destroy his legacy; history will be great to President Obama; not too good for trump or the republicans!

  • Considering America’s history of genocide and oppression we can’t really claim the moral high ground.

  • Very carefully. In other words with much more finesse than our out-of-his-league President is capable of doing.

  • You’re missing my central point. Satan himself is under God’s sovereignty. However, that does not mean that Satan is not free to act within God’s prescribed limits. It also does not mean that whatever Satan does is God’s will does it? The same applies to the world and all its kingdoms and governments which according to scripture are under Satan’s control.

    Scripture makes it clear that the world is under Satan’s sovereignty even though this sovereignty is limited by God. For example, Jesus expressly stated that: “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.” (John 18:36)

    Consider also the Apostle Paul’s clear teaching that “Satan is the god of this world” (2 Cor 4:4) and he is the “prince of the powers of the air” (Ephesians 2:2). The Apostle John concurs with this view and says that “the whole world lies under the power of the evil one.” (1 John 5:19)

    Consider also the teaching of the prophet Hosea who condemns Israel and affirms that there are powers not ordained by God. “They have set up kings, but not by Me: they have made princes, and I knew it not.” (Hosea 8:4)

    Compare Revelation 13 to Romans 13. Here we find a clear picture of a world government given “authority over every tribe and people and tongue and nation”, while clearly not being God’s government. This government (whilst ultimately subject to the sovereignty of God) nevertheless arrogantly blasphemes against heaven and makes war on the saints and overcomes them. We find similar references to very corrupt and evil world governments in Daniel chapters 7 and 8.

    In his unlimited sovereignty God orders the powers that be (the government), but that does not mean that He necessarily morally approves of everything they do, any more than a librarian necessarily creates or approves of the contents of the book he or she shelves .

    Likewise God does not take the responsibility for the existence of the rebellious ‘powers that be’ nor for their shape or identity; they already are. Instead God, in His sovereign, permissive will, orders the powers, He brings them into line, that by His permissive government He lines them up to fulfil His purposes. This is true of all governments – whether they be the governments of dictators or tyrants or constitutional democracies, or even those of bandits or war lords, to the extent to which they exercise real sovereign control.

    The fact God orders and uses the ‘powers’ does not tell us how Christians should respond to government. It does not mean that God has mandated or saved or redeemed or made a particular government His chosen instrument. Instead, all governments are ‘lined up’ or ‘used’ by God in his sovereign ordering.

    This interpretation is further supported by Luke 4:5-8 where the devil shows Jesus all the kingdoms in the world and says all these kingdoms “have been handed over to me, and I give them to whomever I wish”. Jesus does not challenge the claim of Satan to be able to dispose of the rule of all nations.

    Pastor Jeffress should take care when he aligns himself so strongly with President Trump or any secular government for that matter. As a Christian he should be instead aligning himself with Christ. Jesus said: “No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and the god of wealth”. (Matthew 6:24)

  • You’re correct of course. Actually, my memory there goes back to around 1980. I keep forgetting how old I am because of how old I am.

  • My only problem with that is that while we know they want money, what is our basis for trusting them that they will follow through with dismantling it?

  • The incident you’re describing involved the MS St. Louis, a German ship carrying mostly Jewish refugees in 1939. It was denied entry to several countries, including the US, Canada and Cuba. But this wasn’t to appease H’tler, it was based on vague assertions of fears about the refugees being foreign agents (sound familiar?) and not a small amount of anti-Semitism (this was especially in the case of Canada, where its head immigration official at the time was openly opposed to the Jews coming to Canada. The St. Louis was forced to return, not to N/zi-occupied Cyprus, but to Antwerp Belgium, which about a year later was invaded by Germany. While many of the passengers had been able to get to the UK from Antwerp, the majority of the hundreds of those that were forced into Belgium, Holland and France died in the camps.

  • We don’t. Usually when this has been tried, outside parties either did the dismantling or verified it was done. Frankly I think the far more likely risk is of a nuclear accident, than the launch of an atomic bomb.

  • “but to say God has given authority to anyone, especially the president, is ridiculous.” God has given authority to humans–to offer grace, forgiveness, and lovingly claim hurting people for healing through the presence of the on-going divine kingdom emanating through Jesus Christ to all humanity.

  • So what is next, prophet-Jeff? Should trump and company be marching around and round N. Korea blowing their trumpets until their defences come tumbling down [as in the days of Joshua and Jericho]?

  • Well, I certainly thank you for the corrections in the historical details, although if I may borrow from Kangaroo, I obviously think America can NOT boast of any “moral high ground” in this sad episode. America had plenty of anti-Semitism up its sleeve just like Canada, (as in Joseph Kennedy, Cordell Hull, and yes a complicit FDR too, since he played along with those goons).

    Hitler himself interpreted America’s actions to at least indicate that America would not fight for the Jews. The end result — painfully summarized in your last 19 words — is a direct result of what America did to avoid rocking somebody else’s boat (including its own people’s boats).

    In 2012, the US State Dept. issued an official apology — but apparently neither President Obama nor his Secretary of State attended the ceremony. Busy schedule and such, ya know.

  • OK, Jeffress, hold on a minute here. Didn’t your own Jesus reportedly say all the following: 

    “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.” (Matthew 5:9) 

    “You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.’ But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also. Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two. Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you.” (Matthew 5:38-42) 

    Then Jesus said to him, “Put your sword back into its place; for all those who take up the sword shall perish by the sword.” (Matthew 26:52) 

    “But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. Whoever hits you on the cheek, offer him the other also; and whoever takes away your coat, do not withhold your shirt from him either.” (Luke 6:27-29) 

    Maybe it’s just me — cynical, insolent, godless agnostic heathen that I am — but the idea that the deity who supposedly taught all of the above, would commission the Apricot Wonder to launch a nuclear war against North Korea, sure doesn’t appear to make any sense. 

  • What a surprise!! Didn’t take long at all for some religious kooks to go spouting this crap. I swear, next up is trump himself saying his rule is ‘god’s will’.

  • Oh Ben, I had to laugh at that one, I know the feeling, though I’m just a few years behind you.

  • Have you considered the possibility the that junior birdman running N. Korea just might be enough of a megalomaniac to try and start a global war out of the delusions of his grandeur? Of course, some might say the same thing of President Trump, but President Trump is not surrounded by sycophants whose lives are at risk if they so much as fall asleep while he is blithering.

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  • Third generation in of Kims playing the same part. This is not an individual issue of sanity. This is a well rehearsed strategy passed down over the decades, going on 65 years already. This is predictable and everyone but Trump understands this is all political theater. This is why our allies are more worried what Trump will do than Kim.

    Despite all the bluster, the US has the least at stake here. If South Korea and Japan, the two countries most likely to be hurt by a military action by North Korea, considered this a credible threat, they would be taking the lead here. Instead their respective leaders are shaking their heads and considering Trump reckless and stupid.

    Just to show how Ill informed Trump is, he hasn’t even hired an ambassador to South Korea. The State Department is running on a skeleton crew. Foreign policy experts and analysts are leaving in droves.

  • Is there no end to your perfidy?

    If you’re going to go around telling bible believing Christians to do what the Bible actually says instead of what they want to do…

    You will remove all joy, satisfaction, purpose, and self righteousness from their lives.

    How cruel!

  • joke by numbers, does not mean anything to me. i, only preach and teach what is in TheTorah from ELOHEEM.
    but i do know that ELOHEEM is THE COMMANDER of what all ANGELS, Angels, angels. devils and what all physical totality shall do. here in THEIR, Re-Occurring Story of The Physical Creation for six full days. with adam and his sister in charge for all of Physical Totality for The Day of Rest for ELOHEEM prior to the return of Noach.

  • Almost 59, which is maybe still more than a few. But the common experience still applies. Oddly enough, I did find a job through my brother-in-law with an establishment that has a kinder and gentler atmosphere than my previous employer. However, my old employer called me to offer me a position in a different department with a new supervisor, and a 10% raise. Now, 10% more than what I was making before is still not lucrative exactly. But weighing all the benefits from a practical perspective, my old employer nosed out my new employer by a smidgeon. The atmosphere is still, for me, not as congenial and placid as I would like (but then, I’m a natural skeptic and paranoid). Frankly, I’m putting my trust in God that this was the smart and correct decision. But I really thank you for enquiring. Ever forward, Hey?

  • Believe it or not , Stan, I am an 88 year old semi- retired evangelical pastor and a Calvinist. I may not accept every part of Reformed Theology but I certainly accept the social and economic ideas of the great Reformer, John Calvin. Just read Andre Bieler, ‘THE SOCIAL HUMANISM OF CALVIN” (Wipf and Stock Publishers Reprint , n.d.). Calvin would be called a socialist today. I think that his economic views have a lot in common with those of Pope Francis and Bernie Sanders. A far as Rev. Jeffress and other Evangelical leaders who told the gullible ‘sheep’ to vote for Trump, I think that they have sold their souls to the devil. They want to be in with the ‘Power’. Quite a few of them have become millionaires, bilking the ‘sheep’ out of their hard-earned money. preaching about a poor Jesus who died on the cross. You know how Jesus harshly condemned the religious leaders of his time by calling them, “hypocrites’. ending with the words, “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?” (Matthew 23:33). And as far as Mr. Trump is concerned is he so much different from King Herod who at the behest of his daughter, beheaded John the Baptist? He is in favor of waterboarding and of assassinating the relatives of ISIS soldiers. Jesus called Herod a FOX in public (Luke 13:32) What do you think he would call Trump today?

  • Your reply is full of typical calvinist twisting of Christianity and contains nothing I have not heard before. John Calvin & Oliver Cromwell did their best to destroy the Christian Church in England. That is a simple fact the calvinists absolutely refuse to accept. In a nut shell calvinism is a heretical cult which split off from Christianity. Until & unless the individual members find their way back they are lost.

    BTW, do not waste your time or mine responding as I’ve had more than enough nonsense from the calvinists & other members of the alt-right. Especially with the alt-right riot over the removal of a statue of RE Lee, a traitor to his country.

  • Dear Stan, None are so blind a those who don’t want to see!.. You must not have read what I wrote. Did you read any further after you read the word Calvinist? Do you really believe that the Presbyterian and Reformed churches are cults? If you had read what I wrote, at least you would have found out that I am not a fan of the alt-right. In fact, completely the opposite. So, please, read the article again The Lord bless you and your loved ones! Have a Great Day!

    magazine

  • Look so you’re 88. That means nothing. So you’re a so called preacher. Once again that means nothing. What you and your ilk refuse to comprehend your are NOT God’s gift to mankind that was filled approximately 2000 years ago. You do not have “all the answers”, you do not have the right to cram your twisted heretical version down others throats, and calvinism is NOT Christian. Calvin & Cromwell committed treason, heresy, blasphemy, sacrilege, and idolatry. The idolatry came from their heresy of declaring the KJV of the Bible “inerrant” ignoring the fact that it was translated and manipulated to meet King James order to support the heresy of the “divine right of kings”.

    I’m more than a little tired of the sanctimonious chest beating of the calvinists who falsely use the Bible to support their goal of turning the US into a Theocracy. Quite frankly you call me blind, one of the frequently used terms used against those of us who have a deeper and broader appreciation & understanding of the Bible. One of the nick names for those of us who belong to the Episcopal Church is “educated Christians” as we do not fall for this narrow extremest false interpretation.

    My recommendation is that you join a mainstream orthodox church and do so quickly. At 88 you probably do not have a lot of time remaining to learn the error of your ways.

    BTW, I’m not responding to anymore of your posts. I have much better things to do rather than debate someone who refuses to learn. I’m a lot more familiar with your type than you may expect.

    One more thing, you do not have the right to address me as “Dear Stan”. That’s just another one of the many calvinist tactics. I’m Dr Stan as in having an earned research based doctorate.

  • One last thing. Your post serves as a perfect example of just how calvinists twist the words of others to suit their own agenda.

  • Thanks Dr.Stan. I never would have believed that you are an Episcopalian. Please, share my article with some of your fellow Episcopalians. You are a member of a very respected mainline denomination. So am I. Unless you don’t accept the Presbyterian Church USA. I like to show your article to one of my fellow Episcopalian pastors here and see what he thinks about it. And by the way, I don’t know many of my fellow Presbyterians who use the KJV. Most of us use the NIV. I would love to read your thesis. You send me yours and I send you mine. Most likely it won’t compare with your Dr. thesis. Mine is only a Master’s thesis which I wrote when I studied at Princeton Seminary. Finally, my mother was almost 101 years old when she died. I am quite healthy and don’t use any medication. So maybe the Lord will give me a few more years with my loving wife Cathy And I deeply apologize for calling you Dear Stan. From now on I will call you Dr. Stan. Honor to whom honor is due! Your humble servant, Arnold

  • God has not given this fool authority to speak on his behalf. These crazies are just dying to see what a nuclear bomb looks like in their lifetime. The irresponsible, repugnant comments that make like they just said “Trump can have ice cream today”, when words can start wars, and wars kill people… potentially millions of people. Imagine Trump going to prison for crimes against humanity, genocide. Pastor cowboy needs to stay in Texas

  • What kind of holy man says it’s ok to kill? He should not be the teacher of that chapel. God specifically says , DO NOT KILL , what the.fuck is.wrong with you ,.oh i.remember you are.babtist cursed you. Stole from the grauls, out.of the coverd box , ask.for.fogivenezz , and yes it is.ok to say GOD DAM , thoes two words let’s
    God , LUCIFER, LOUCIOUS, know they need to judge someone for their wrongfully doings,. I am WHITE ROCKY R BISHOP CHOCOLATE son of william Franklin , and genette lillianne BISHOP, of colorado.i have.neen ordained thru Chaplin Mary Murphy, thru the.magic of.souls from the other side . I’m working on getting a place of sanctuary, soon , and I will teach all the word of the gods . That is if you are ready ,
    Announcer, dude . P.s. my email is. Whiterockybishop48@gmail.com if. Anyone would.like to. Comment, or.to know. The.truth ,I will e entualy.get replays out .

  • So mr Kim jo un I hope the letter I sent a few.months ago saved your brother of South Korea life we are going to be changing from a president, to king status in the real near future ,please as I ask I am working on disassembling, defusing, any and all wepons.of.mass destruction to show good faith ,the process will be video recorded so the world will know the king lives ,

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